I'm going on a Grand Canyon trip and am trying to decide which boat to bring. A strictly river runner may get boring, but my Kingpin may be a little uncomfortable and slow for 18 days on the river. Any suggestions.

Necky Gliss is the Grand Canyon Kayak I think, I just went in March in my Chronic and that was great for the really perfect features but not fast enough for many of the big glassy entrance waves and laterals. Last time I took the Gliss and got more surfing done. Carry your boat up and run the Tapeats Creek gorge!

It would depend if your trip leader is considering you as a safety boater??
I brought a larger volume boat in 1995 on our canyon trip.
Back in 1995 the smaller boats weren't so common, I had a Perception
Corsica Matrix. It was awesome for surfing the huge waves and getting pummeled in scary holes.

We had two fully loaded 18 ft. rafts flip and as one of three safety boaters
I was glad to have the larger volume boat both for comfort and stability as I was rescuing soggy freaked out rafters and later when we had to chase and push the rafts to shore.

250 miles of mostly flat water deserves a sea kayak or some other touring boat. Long pointy and fast.

Don't listen to that get on the rafts and drink beer for the flat water, but around every corner is the potential for the surf of your life! I could name few spots where you will certainly find it.

The canyon is mostly flat water but a sea kayak is for the sea or a lake.
The person that suggested that has obviously never been in the canyon.
Huge glassy waves, killer surf holes and extremly big water rapids are everywhere.

Most of the time you'll be in a raft with your kayak strapped on top. Don't get too lax because you'll miss some big waves.

Bring a comfortable hybrid or river runner!!!

I wrote this reponse to someone else recently... so here it is again... And to sea kayak recommendation...way wrong!
>>>>>>>>
We just did the Canyon the first 2 weeks in May. There were 6 (of 17) or so of us in Wavesport Diesel’s… 65’s and 75’s from Class 3 boaters to Class 5 boaters… all loved their boat for the Canyon. The really hard core folks liked their smaller play boats as well. There were several older big boats (e.g. Outlaw and RPM’s) as well. The outfitting of the newer boats was really nice though. I normally boat a BigEZ. I tried a Y before I bought the Diesel and I rejected it largely due to the outfitting and lack of thigh control. The Diesel differs in the following ways from the BigEZ:

- even better outfitting…especially like the ratcheting back band and bulkhead footrest… much better thigh control than older boats…great for edging
- Diesel is faster… helps on flat water and in ferries
- Diesel Ferry angle is tighter… less forgiving… give too much and get blown down out of the ferry (typical of bigger boats)
- Diesel surfs really well… no squirting… no unintentional squirts in the ever present squirrely water
- Need to edge more on the Diesel to carve into and out of eddies or turns… this takes some practice but becomes second nature
- Diesel was reasonably easy to change downstream lines in… unlike some other boats in its class where once you pick a line you are in it.
- Diesel tends to go over features where the Big EZ goes through features
- Diesel feels less stable in primary stability… but very stable in secondary stability… took some practice… but no problem
- Diesel rolls very easily… but so does my BigEZ
- Diesel has lots of on-board storage for camera gear for hikes etc... w/out affecting trim

Although some smaller boaters I know have bought the 65 Diesel… I have seen many smaller boaters go for the 75 and love it… They say and I have heard that it helps them in harder water and helps the boat function as a creek boat for them.

Steve

Squirt boat... of course.

don't take a creek boat - there's nothing lamer than folks that blitz the flatwater and bypass the playspots. Kingpin is awesome, just make sure you can handle her for 18 days and you're not pulling roll attempts from the top to bottom of Crystal

Clay has some good advice
http://boatertalk.com/forum/BoaterTalk/823846

I would bring something you can surf big glassy waves in but also enjoy the many play holes along the way. A Riot Turbo would be ideal. After spending some time down there, as well as the White Nile, I love small boats in big water. You spend less time getting pounded in holes as you sub out instead of swim out, and you can truely enjoy the playground presented by the big rapids. Someone had a great point as to siting on the rafts and drinking beer on the flat stretches. Enjoy the rapids and be careful on the sidestreams. Techniclly it is against the LAW to hike and paddle them due to the impact that hikers and portagers incur upon the riparian cooridor. So either be stealthy and don't portage or just hang on the river. The desert is a fragile environment that takes a long time to recover from damage, so be nice to it. Enjoy your trip and feel free to email with questions or play spots,
Jesse
j_wilfley@yahoo.com

A friend of mine took a Kingpin down this season and said it was tons of fun when playing, but got pushed around ALOT in the bigger drops and in the eddy lines. If your main focus is playing, take a Crazy 88, Vision, or ZG. Something that plays like crazy but still has some hull speed.

If you just want to run the river and also do some surfing, check out a boat like the Hoss/li'l joe/Trigger from Liquidlogic or the H3 from Pyranha. These boats will have a bit more hull speed and perform better in the bigger drops, but will still be able to surf the big waves and you'll still have fun. Both those boats are slightly more playful than say the Diesel or the Mamba.

If you're not looking to play at all, take a Diesel or Mamba.

Have fun. Later.

New Randolf must have taken a happy pill, he's usually a negative sarcastic bonehead.
Even New Randolf can change welcome back!!

slalom boat.